Chancellor of the Exchequer Rachel Reeves was left scrambling in a recent interview with Channel 4. Joining Economics Editor Helia Ebrahimi to discuss the £4.7 billion black hole in the defence budget. “The characterisation is that defence is not a priority for you,” the journalist said.

“Just judge me on my record, I’m very happy to take ownership of this,” Reeves replied. “And if it is all about the treasury, then I’d take responsibility for the 27% increase in defence spending in real terms. I take responsibility for the biggest increase in defence spending since the end of the Cold War.

“I take responsibility for a Defence Investment Plan that really meets the moment to protect ourselves, to protect our allies, including Ukraine, and I think it is the Defence Investment Plan that people should get behind. And now, instead of complaining, instead of talking about the money, let’s get on and deliver and get that value from the £300billion that we are putting into defence spending over the next four years.”

As Ebrahimi interjected, pointing out that a third (£4.7billion) of the Defence Plan had not been funded and was therefore left to the Autumn budget, Reeves struggled to maintain her calm demeanour.

“So do you reject that idea about black holes?” Ebrahimi said, putting her in the hot seat. As Reeves attempted to reply, the Channel 4 correspondent continued to probe her with more questions. Asked if aspiring Prime Minister Andy Burnham was being left with a black hole, Reeves explained: “It’s not that a third of defence spending isn’t funded…um, we’re going to be spending £300billion over four years…”

“So do you reject that idea about black holes?” Ebrahimi cut in. “Totally,” Reeves said, before arguing that to “have a strong defence, you have to have a strong economy.”